Friday, May 23, 2008

John McCain's Pastoral Scandals

John McCain is running against... John McCain, apparently. Repeatedly we have seen McCain shooting himself in the foot. His latest misfire: First courting and then rejecting two Malignant Ministers.

(Wait a minute: I'm confused. Isn't there supposed to be a separation of church and state? And, isn't it true that the IRS can revoke a church's tax-exempt status when it becomes politicized?

Tell that to Jeremiah Wright, John Hagee, and Rod Parsley. Apparently they're either unconcerned about their tax-exempt status, or we've been misinformed.)

I never liked Pastor John Hagee. In fact, I do not like any TV evangelist and I disapprove of any pastor who puts congregation and building size before caring for his flock. Since that eliminates any of the "Big Box" churches, you can safely say that many of John Hagee's philosophies would also be repugnant to me.

John Hagee has fallen from grace because he apparently made the statement that God caused Hitler to persecute the Jews in order to get them over to the Promised Land. Now THERE is an interesting philosophy: God does evil to create good. And, to add insult to injury, God is apparently happy to persecute his own people!

After John Hagee's interesting interpretation of God's nature, we come to Rod Parsley. I had never heard of him until now, and I could have gone my entire life without hearing about him!

Parsley apparently made the startling statement that America was formed to defeat the Islamic faith. Hmmm, I can't seem to find that little tidbit in any of the founding fathers' documents and it seems to have been left out of the Constitution, too. You'd think something of THAT importance would've made it in there.

(Thanks, Parsley. That won't increase our tensions with the Islamic terrorists or anything.)

And yet, McCain's pastoral scandals can hardly rival the case of Barack Obama and a prejudiced black supremacist like Jeremiah Wright.

For one thing, the guys that McCain is repudiating were never pastors in his church. He never sat in their pews for 20 years, nodding his head as they ranted and raved from the pulpit. In his defense, he knew little of what they actually believed. However, this is also to his detriment: Is he willing to throw his lot in with people that he has little knowledge of?

To sum it up: McCain is now doing what he feels he needs to do.

I would suggest to McCain that he is up against a man who is preaching about unity. He could have handled his own minor scandals in a better manner. Certainly, he would have been smart to never pander to the religious right by courting such poor examples of "Christianity".

McCain is justified in distancing himself quickly. I believe that McCain thought he would look very good in comparison to Obama, but instead it will dilute the Jermiah Wright scandal and place it at a much lower level than it should be.


The Lazy Iguana said...

Are you serious?

McCain ACTIVELY went after the Hagee endorsement. He all but begged the man to endorse him.

KNOWING what Hagee said. He stood there and accepted the endorsement anyway.

From BEFORE the Wright thing.

And McCain calling Parsley a "spiritual guide". And did Parsley say America was founded to destroy Islam?? What about freedom and liberty and "no taxation without representation"?? Liberal history revision?

More Hagee stuff.

Hagee going off the deep end plugging his book.

And all this time, while these guys were saying all this crap - McCain was trolling around looking for an endorsement. And then he gets the endorsement. And ONLY when questions began to arise, mostly because of the Wright thing, about McCain's wacky pastors did he move away from them.

As opposed to Obama, who did not apparently seek out endorsements - and who tossed the pastor under the bus rather quickly.

McCain is not grasping at straws here - it is pure damage control. He is not looking for publicity, he is acting to undo what he has already done.

McCain desperately wants the evangelical vote. He knows they did not want him. So he reached out to ANYONE who he thought that "Christians" would listen to. And who did old man "out of touch" McCain reach out to? People like Hagee. Senile old man must think Hagee represents mainstream Christian views! And maybe he does. He has a lot of followers and I do not hear anyone but people like myself telling people like Hagee to please sit down and shut up.

People who walked away from the Church years ago because even when I was 12 I could see people like Hagee were crazy. Meanwhile, where is everyone else? Quietly sitting by, allowing it all to go on. Not standing up. Allowing Hagee and his minions to become the voice of mainstream Christianity.

And then Fox "News" accuses the secularists of wanting to destroy Christianity. No, if you ask me Christianity is doing a fine job of destroying itself. It does not need help from anyone.

Now you may rationalize this any way you want. Yea Obama is worse. Yea Obama is a Muslim. McCain never stood with these people a few weeks ago kissing their boots. Oh no. This is all for nothing.

But you know what? It is not going to work. Whats good for the goose is good for the gander. The right wanted to make a big stink about Wright? Fine. They did. And now they have many MANY of their own Wrights to contend with. People who represent the "base" of the party. where people like Wright are not the base of the Democratic party. Democrats all hate God, remember? So why would any of us listen to a pastor?

Meridian Mississippi LOST a Republican seat in a special election to a Democrat. That is all you need to know. You know how red Meridian Mississippi is? I have family who live there. I have been there many times. It is redder than the British tourist who goes to a Florida beach in July for a week and never uses any sunscreen. THAT red. Maybe even redder. Meridian has elected nothing but Republicans since the Dixiecrats split off the Democrat party during the civil rights movement.

But they just elected a Democrat. Go figure.

Bottom line - the endorsements Obama rejected the man never went after in the first place. But now McCain is having to reject endorsements that he begged for not more than a few weeks ago.

THAT is a difference.

Jungle Mom said...

I certainly agree with you about Hagee and his types. You are correct in that the comparison of Obama's pastor of 20 years and the endorsements for McCain by 'Pastors" is a big stretch.
There was no need for McCain to re act the way he did. he will have problems getting the 'evangelical' vote, no matter what because of other issues.
But of the three contest! I'll vote McCain!

Saur♥Kraut said...

Lazy, Thanks for adding to the info out there. I'll look into it! Although I do doubt that McCain knew about Hagee's comments. He's dumb (don't get me wrong) but he's not THAT dumb. He wants the Presidency too bad.

You ARE right that he is desperately trying to pander to the Christian right. Fat chance of his impressing anyone there - he might as well give it up.

Jungle Mom, I agree on all points but the vote. I will hold my nose and vote for McCain if Obama is my only choice, but that's the only way it'll happen. ALL the candidates reek.

Anonymous said...

Have it on record that I'm voting 'NO' for President.

This is a very thought provoking post, Saur. Good stuff...

Think of it this way..verbal support from the KKK, might incite McCain to denounce them and their organization regardless of McCain's involvement, or lack of. Although, these pastors are nowhere as close to insidious.

Saur, I'm going to add a few thoughts regarding these pastors from your comments. It's a bit off topic, but humor me.

In fact, I do not like any TV evangelist and I disapprove of any pastor who puts congregation and building size before caring for his flock. Since that eliminates any of the "Big Box" churches, you can safely say that many of John Hagee's philosophies would also be repugnant to me.

I would agree with your disapproval of neglecting pastors. This is why so many in leadership delegate, as do the military, a CEO, the Pope, and those teachers who need parents in the classroom. The Old Testament shows us (Lev., Num. and Deut.) that Moses delegated so he could herd the entire nation of Israel across the desert.

I will point out that the size of a church does not indicate the pastor's ability to teach or lead. It's easy to question a large church or stereotype them as money grubbing, doctrinally off, and/or label derelict pastors. Writing off the lot of them is not a fair statement. This stereotyping is what hurts the real message, from honest to God pastors of large churches that practice what they preach.

As a God fearing person, I would say that God uses many of these 'big box churches' even those who we may view as corrupt or doctrinally off. I don't understand, but it's true. I don't get how people are truly healed after Benny Hinn touches them with his COAT!? The guy has an ugly combover, theatrical meetings, but people get healed. Moses killed a man in his youth, Saul killed thousands of Christians before he became Paul, even the disciples were surly fisherman.

Ironic that even David, "Man after God's own heart", is an author of Psalms yet he was responsible for a murder of his mistress' husband. Do you read the Psalms that were written after this blatant sin? Do you believe that those Psalms are God ordained? I absolutely do.

I'd love to judge these pastors, write them off...but really only One person knows their heart.

blogger is not letting me log in, sorry for the anon comment....

Fred said...

It more or less negates the issue that Obama has with Wright.

The spin doctors now have video of Hagee endorsing McCain with McCain signs as a backdrop. They'll package that to their advantage knowing people will connect the two.

Obama is dancing in the aisles.

The Lazy Iguana said...

You are all insane.

McCain crawled on all fours to the "pastors" for endorsements. And of course McCain knew what these guys had said. I knew. If I knew and I am an idiot then why did McCain not know? And he wants to be President when his memory is already spotty at best?

Do we really want that?

Also please notice that the Wright comments played over and over and over and over and over and over were all of what - 10 seconds each? 15 seconds each? And there were only three of them? Four of them?

I can pull up TONS of Hagee comments and Celery or Parsley or whatever the other guy's name is. Comments LONGER than 30 seconds. Comments that run on for minutes at a time. In full context.

Wright had a 30 second clip saying the government released AIDS on people. Well here is Hagee saying GOD sent AIDS and will soon send the Bird Flu to kill us all, but if you buy his book the answer to prevent it is right there.

Notice how the clip is much longer than 10 seconds.

Hagee suggesting God helped Bush steal the 2000 election. These statements were made in 2003.

Hagee supporting Benny Hinn's faith healing scam.

We do not need hospitals, we only need more Benny Hinn! John McCains health care policy perhaps???

All these clips are still longer than the 15 second Wright comments!

Hagee saying terrorism is our fault, for trying to get Israel to return some occupied land.

Hagee saying that Hitler did nothing that the Catholic Church did not already do for 800 years, that the Catholic Church is false and is the "whore of Babylon".

McCain in February or March, accepting the endorsement. Gladly. Before he rejected the endorsement.

I await the fallout of this with a large amount of glee. See my position has not changed here. I said that the Farrakhan endorsement did not mean anything, as Obama is not Farrakhan and did not stand next to Farrakhan to accept the endorsement. Obama promptly rejected it.

Also, Obama is not Wright. Wright is not running. Wright has all the freedom he wants to say whatever crazy shit he wants. 1st Amendment and so on. Yea, Obama was a member of the church. So that means he HAD TO agree 100% with everything he heard there? Really? Have you ever heard something you did not agree with in Church? Did you remain in the pew or did you stand up and storm out in protest?

I bet you stayed. Everyone has.

Also Obama rejected the Wright comments. It should also be noted that the "America hater" Wright served in the military. The US Military. He was in the US Marines from 1961 - 1963 and then he went to Corpsman School for the US Navy. He eventually became part of the White House medical team.

America hater huh? So people who join the Marines, and do so well there they are sent to medical school in the US Navy hate America huh? No wonder Cheney and Bush love America so much! They never served active duty service. Of course - it all makes sense now.

How fun, to take 20+ years of preaching and 6 years of very honorable military service and boil the man down to a few 10 second video clips.

But whatever, Obama never stood there while Farrakhan and/or Wright endorsed him.

McCain did. McCain stood there and smiled all pretty for the cameras and blew smoke and sunshine up Hagee's ass. THIS YEAR. In 2008. AFTER the many many years of Hagee saying crazy things. And then the old man claims he did not know about the statements?

So now, months later, he rejects the endorsements he ALREADY ACCEPTED???

So how has my position not changed? I said that Farrakhan, the asshole he is, has the right to vote. Like it or not. He can vote, and he can say who he is voting for. That does not mean that the person he is voting for agrees with Farrakhan. Wright has the right to pick a candidate too. Farrakhan is not running for office. Neither is Wright. Just because someone says something, and they may even be your friend for many years - it does not mean you hold the same view.

So I said then and Ill say now this is all bullshit. McCain is not Hagee and Obama is not Wright. Each man is his own man and may very well hold different views on the same subject.

It was the REPUBLICANS that said because Farrakhan endorsed Obama that Obama must agree with him. They backed off that a little, after saying it over and over and over and over to enforce the false story that Obama is a Muslim, but whatever. They backed down. And then the Wright thing came up. Again - Obama MUST agree 100% with EVERYTHING Wright ever said in his entire life! Right?

But McCain does not agree with men he stands on the stage with, openly and happily accepting their endorsement. Calling them "great leaders" and "moral pillars" and whatever else he said about them - all positive. No, he does not agree with them. Not at all. TOTALLY different here!

Do you Republicans like butter or maple syrup with your waffles?

Saur♥Kraut said...

Lazy, you were right! I will now have to revise my post. And McCain is an idiot - but we knew that already.